Kidney disease? Incontinence

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This topic contains 1 reply, has 2 voices, and was last updated by  Lena 4 years, 4 months ago.

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  • #11761

    Anonymous

    Josie is a 12 1/2 yo Australian Shepherd. Aside from hip arthritis, she has never been sick. She has been raw fed her whole life, grain free.

    A couple of months ago I discovered she was incontinent – we found a puddle on the floor where she had been resting. She has since wet our bed in the night, as well as once on the couch when she was resting. I started her on some holistic incontinence formulas, Leaks No More drops, Tinkle Tonic – I was throwing everything at her and she seemed to go dry for several weeks. I figured I could wean her down on the Leaks No More, and I ran out of the chewable incontinence tablets but figured I’d see if those really made a difference. A couple of days ago I forgot to give her the morning LNM drops and she ended up leaking a puddle both in the hallway when she was excited, and on the couch when she was resting. I put a diaper on her, which she saturated. I ran out of LNM drops and had to give her a small dose, all that remained, at bedtime. She leaked through her diaper on the bed during the night, so it was a substantial release. Thankfully the LNM drops arrived today, and I got a three-pack! The chewables arrived today as well.

    Meanwhile, I took her to the vet a few weeks ago to get her worked up on this. Urine was cultured but negative, and was clear and of the right color. Her bloodwork was more concerning. She was not fasted for the bloodwork.

    Her CK was high, 371
    amylase high, 1460
    BUN high, 35

    I know that raw fed dogs have slightly higher BUN, but hers is out of range. My vet thought she might have early kidney and/or liver disease. Could this be causing the incontinence, or do we have two separate things going on?

    I thought feeding raw would prevent kidney disease, though some think the higher protein is hard on the kidneys. But is the protein really higher, with the water content of raw? At any rate, should I do additional testing? Might the lack of fasting have an affect? I use digestive enzymes which include amylase – would that have an affect on blood levels?

    Should I try the praying mantis for the incontinence? Is this easily obtained?

    Thanks for being there, Lena!

    Betsy

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    #11762

    Lena
    Keymaster

    Hi Betsy,
    There is more info on protein and kidney failure in cats which are more prone to it. http://pathwithpaws.com/blog/2011/03/04/kidney-failure-in-cats-how-chinese-medicine-and-diet-can-help/
    The bottom line is that I believe and have seen that high quality protein doesn’t hurt the kidneys. Early kidney disease should be treated with high protein food IMO.
    When I am testing for early kidney disease I look at two main things
    -urine specific gravity which they would have tested when doing the urinalysis. If it is above 1.025 it is not kidney disease. If it is below then it may or may not be kidney disease.
    -creatinine If this is raised it is either kidney disease or dehyration (If creatinine is raised BUN will be also)
    BUN alone to me doesn’t mean a lot, however if creatinine is very high end normal, BUN is high and USG is lower than 1.025 you may be in very early kidney disease. And raw diets can sometimes raise BUN slightly.
    Amylase being high usually indicates some pancreatic inflammation but can also be linked to the kidneys.
    CK could be from muscle issues related to arthritis and usually being slightly elevated doesn’t concern me too much.
    If the leaks no more is helping her with incontinence then I would continue it.
    I use the mantis as part of a formula, not alone. I have one main formula I use for young dogs that contains it and one for old dogs. The main formula I use for older dogs is based on a formula called Liu Wei Di huang Wan to which I add mantis and 2-3 other herbs. It also helps support the kidneys into older age and treats early kidney disease so it may be a good formula for her all around if the Leaks No More ever is not enough.
    I now have an etsy store where I sell my formulas. I don’t have that one up but if you ever want it just special request “old dog incontinence formula” and I will make it for you. http://www.etsy.com/shop/Kingdomofbasil?ref=si_shop

    I had not heard of the LNM before, sounds like it is a good product. Thanks for mentioning it.

    best wishes,
    Lena

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